Glorious Alpha Two Testers!
Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Phase I of Alpha Two testing will occur on weekends. Each weekend is scheduled to start on Fridays at 10 AM PT and end on Sundays at 10 PM PT. Find out more here.
Check out Alpha Two Announcements here to see the latest Alpha Two news and update notes.
Our quickest Alpha Two updates are in Discord. Testers with Alpha Two access can chat in Alpha Two channels by connecting your Discord and Intrepid accounts here.
Comments
That is not true besides having to deal with the emotional and physiological damage from being murdered. i also have to deal with spawning possibly half way across the map and the death penalty. Definitely not the same.
Well, i mean be asshole- deal with conciquences. To some people its more annoying when someone is being asshole than just dying in game
Murder is the unlawful killing of someone.
You were not murdered, your character dropped to 0 hp in a video game and was forced to respawn. With how this game is designed, you suffer further penalties. Murdered people don't respawn.
If losing in a game that you chose to play causes you so many issues, that is on you. Have you ever tried to improve your attitude on this or do you assume that this is an ok way to act?
A**holes I can deal with, I do it daily. Murderers on the other hand I deal with rarely and wish to keep it that way. Just me nice to people most will return the favor, just use your words and save the sword.
My contention is and will continue to be that murdering another player in game elicits a similar emotional response as being a victim of a RL crime, I have personally felt the same emotions as when I was jumped in the ghetto 40 years ago. I still don't understand why people can claim to feel joy and pleasure from killing another person in game, but expect victim not to feel any emotion at all.
Literally no one said the one getting PK’d shouldn’t experience negative emotion from it. They’re saying that being mad, or frustrated, or sad at a video game is not even vaguely comparable to real life traumatic experiences.
Because it isn’t. You get attacked in real life and you can end up with symptoms of PTSD and physical injury. You get attacked in a game and at worst you’re moderately inconvenienced.
You don't need a video game, you need a therapist.
If thats honestly how you react I strongly suggest you dont play video games because that is honestly unhealthy if you cant differentiate reality from make-believe enough to control your own emotions.
Murder is a game term, related to Corruption. Murder and kill are two terms used in AoC, to separate the mechanics of the death system. Please don't confuse the game term with real life annologies. Because killing in AoC is permitted, murdering is not.
If you don't understand the difference, I recomend visiting Ashes101 and/or the Wiki.
So you don't enjoy competition or playing a game against others? a game where some players can win and others lose.
This isn't real life, it's a game you are choosing to play against others. Players aren't "killing a victim," you are beating an opponent in a game, a game you both chose to play.
Do you believe no game should ever be allowed to have pvp?
@Kneczhevo
...Did you not read what I was responding to?
Yes, murder is one of the terms to use to describe actions in the game but as with many things in games and as you said, it is not what is really happening. I was not confusing the terms, the person I was responding to was trying to bring the real-world context of the word into the conversation.
You are a little wrong, in the context of AoC, both actions that have been referred to as "killing" and "murder" are both permitted in AoC, murder just has a penalty. It's a game where the developers have complete control over what is permitted and not. By the developers allowing murder, they permit it. The presence of a penalty does not change that.
People used to take video games very serious, as they do today. Except, back in the day, there were more serious losses (loss of levels and gear, even in pve, stolen accounts, etc.) in games. And people would commit real life crimes, in retaliation. Not, down playing today's issues, it's just lessoned.
Most games, now, have mechanics to prevent these irl crimes (bound items, no death penalty, etc.). You can call it "dumbing down" games. But, it was nessisary, for the real world (lawmakers).
Remember, that opening scene, in the movie Player One? Where the fella was jumping out the window, because he lost an item? True story, look it up.
People used to assault others, even commiting murder, over stolen/sold/hacked accounts. Very messy business.
So, to bring these RL analogies to the conversation is very serious.
So your claim is this can not happen. I disagree. What makes you think that being attacked in a video game can not elicit a similar response. Dev's work so hard to create an immersive environment so you escape and feel like you are actually there and if successful, your brain is there completely into what is happening around you in this pixel world oblivious to anything around you in RL at that moment and then you are attacked and your brain reacts to what just happened to you, it may take a few seconds or minutes to go, whew I'm actually still alive and you think this can't have long term effects on your brain. Most RL firefights last less than a couple minutes but have long term effects too an involved soldiers emotional condition
I personally have felt depression and dispare from an in game murder for several days and have never returned to games for this reason alone. This doesn't happen every time and seems to depend on my immersion level at the time. But it is very possible.
I have and after several visits and several hundred dollar we came to the conclusion that my views and concerns were perfectly normal on this subject.
That is one of the most bizarre things I have ever read.
I apologize. For some reason I singled you out, of the conversation. Really hard to keep track.
But, my statements still stand, to all.
I have been a crime victim on several occasions and that is my point the emotional reaction has been similar in both instances. And your claim seems insensitive to me, or a complete lack of compassion.
Dude, I lived for years in a ghetto neighborhood in LA. Shitty, double-gated apartment, cockroaches everywhere inside and outside, gang members regularly hanging around my apartment shirtless with black-eyes, crimes occurring literally every hour. You think you're the only person on here who has been mugged??
The difference between you and me is that I can distinguish video games from real life. If I die in a video game, I can look down and see that I haven't been stabbed. So what if my character died? I can just respawn like nothing happened. Bricktop is correct, it's actually insulting to me for you to trivialize getting mugged by comparing it to dying in a video game.
That's the risk/reward Steven was talking about, you get to play an amazing game but maybe you get lifetime PTSD for losing an item
The thing is, in a game, you aren't the victim. You choose to play a game where people can "attack" each other and if you are frustrated, you can walk away. Something victims of actual crimes can't do.
If you are being honest then how about you work to get over this. Play some games with open pvp and let yourself get attacked. Get used it being a part of whatever game world and play around in it. Digest the frustration you feel when you die. Maybe do some duels so you know how to react when someone does attack you.
Not saying you need to lose your pve preference, just saying if this is an issue for you, you should work to get over it. Why should a game change if you won't even try to.
If you want, pm me and I'll play the game with you.
Not quite sure psychology or neuroscience corroborates this perspective. If there was any evidence that playing GTA, Battlefield etc, lead to similar forms of PTSD or aggression as real-life crime / war, then there would be plenty of outlets ready to jump on that opportunity to ban such games.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/ulterior-motives/201908/the-evidence-video-games-lead-violence-is-weak
https://www.theguardian.com/games/2020/jul/22/playing-video-games-doesnt-lead-to-violent-behaviour-study-shows
Whether it's merchant discounts for tiers of positive reputation, unique titles, or whatever sounds best. I just think "punish the bad guys" has been done to death and never quite feels that good, imo.
only problem with that is people would exploit it by voluntarily farming each other for those rewards. Punishment is a better prevention less likely to be exploited
To me, that's just a lack of vision/imagination. If trading is biased towards negative rep then they'll just dig each other into holes. If people level alts to be farmed by friends, maybe make the rep account based instead of character, like how BDO treats your account like a family of chars.
I would just rather see a more active ecosystem of owpvp than one that just ends up dying because attacking anyone is too punishing to be worth it.
Everything that needs to be said has been said.
Gaming has already been scientifically proven to be a boon to human psychology despite what conservative/Karen's want to say about it in order to build a soap box to stand upon for political purposes.
The one you have now is more interested in allowing you to self affirm as opposed to helping you deal with issues.
Self affirmation doesn't deal with issues, it allows you to live with them easier. This should only be applied to issues that only affect you personally.
However, since games are often used as a way to help people deal with PTSD, I dont for even a second believe you are being honest here.
then people will just make more accounts, its not a lack of imagination its just a better way to keep people from exploiting while still keeping playing from griefing as much. There will be plenty of open world pvp, corruption is just to reduce griefing, you will still have plenty of people who fight back, bounty hunt, raid/defend caravans, siege, etc. It is a PvX game after all.
I actually enjoy seeing people attempt to argue that intrepid should completely strip down every system in this game just so people can opt out of pvp.
What I’ve never understood, because it’s completely illogical, is why you “elites” have problems with the care-bears having their PvE fun. It’s as if you “elites” are little tyrants and want to force everyone to play the way you want to play. Oh but I do understand the mindset to some extent, you “elites” want a target rich environment so you can have more fun at others’ expense.
The logical problem you obviously have, well not obvious to you, is that your target rich environment won’t remain target rich for long. Care-bears won’t stick around for long after getting repeatedly ganked. For some reason you “elites” don’t understand that.
Other open world pvp that occurs is player vs player or party vs party, and its mainly due to social interactions between the two. If you cant share the hunting spot, said something not nice etc etc. So theres really really low chance of getting just randomly geting pk'd, usually because the guy is leaving the game or something...so theres plenty of avenues for carebears to avoid pvp and be carebears.
I don't. It hurts my heart.
No everybody perfectly understands that. That doesn't mean the entire game should be changed around to prevent people from quitting the game. A game that tries to make everybody happy ends up making nobody happy. Just take a quick gander at New World for your proof. This isn't even an unrestricted PvP game, you have the corruption system there to prevent people from being griefed. All the top gear comes from WORLD bosses, and some people are advocating they come out of instances. Do you not see how this hurts the game? I want everybody to have as much PvE fun as possible in the open world and not in an instance. Nobody wants to stop PvErs from having fun. However if they claim that instances are the ONLY way they can have fun, without EVER seeing the open world content, well quite frankly I become very suspect of their true intentions.
I like killing bosses too. Instances allow players to skip all the politics, dangers, and player driven interactions of an open world game. The least amount of instancing in the game the better off it will be. If you are a massive PvEr and all you want to do is hide in instanced dungeons and PvE all day this is simply not going to be a very fun game for you. You WILL have the possibility of having to PvP almost all the time. It doesn't make us bad people for trying to point this out to them. They really should just go play something else if the game launches and the PvE content it isn't good enough for them, no?
Players will need to be able to do both to achieve success in Ashes of Creation. PvP to secure PvE farm spots. PvP to siege down a node.PvP to secure caravans routes to craft gear. PvP to secure world bosses to get the best gear in the game. If people don't want to PvP AT ALL like I see some of these people saying, why are they even here?
I have no idea why this thread has gone on for as long as it has. You "deal with random player killing in an MMO" by just getting over it and doing something else with your time if it bothers you.